Ukip vs the world

How an anti-political party seeks to explode politics

4 May 2013

Ukip hope that this week’s county council elections are just the fireworks display before the big bang. In 2014 they think they can blow open British politics by winning a nationwide election. If they can succeed in doing that, they would almost certainly force Labour into matching the Tories’ pledge to hold a referendum on the EU after the next general election. This would guarantee the public its first vote on Britain’s EU membership in 40 years.

The success of Ukip at making inroads during this campaign has caused some unease in Tory ranks. But a Ukip victory in the European elections a year before a general election would throw the Tories into a proper panic. Legions of backbenchers would demand that David Cameron brings forward the referendum on EU membership. Others would demand that he pledges to leave the union altogether unless he gets everything he wants in the renegotiation. There would also be plenty of voices claiming that the answer was a tougher line on immigration, one of the issues driving Ukip’s rise.

Then there would be those Tory MPs who would insist that some sort of accommodation or electoral pact must be made with Ukip. For his part, Nigel Farage emphasises that he’s still open to the idea — one he first floated in The Spectator last year — of joint Tory/Ukip candidates. ‘The bar to it’, he says, ‘is simple: David Cameron.’ He predicts that this idea is ‘going to resurface as an issue after Friday’ because of the local election results.

But the idea that Ukip will be victorious in the 2014 European elections is fast becoming the received wisdom in Westminster. More than a handful of Tory MPs, including one senior backbencher, privately admit that they’ll vote Ukip in 2014 to try to push their party in a more Eurosceptic direction.

When I recently remarked to one influential figure at No. 10 that Ukip might come first in this 2014 poll, I was cut off with an irritable, ‘I think it’s pretty certain they’ll do that.’ I was then offered an explanation as to why this would be worse for Ed Miliband than David Cameron. The level of detail in the answer suggested that this is something that has been discussed many times by the Prime Minister’s inner circle.

A Ukip win would lend weight to Farage’s demands to be included in the TV debates at the general election. This is a thought that fills the Tories with horror. When I asked one confidant of the Prime Minister if Cameron would take part if Ukip was included, the response was simple: ‘God, no.’

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So, why does Farage — a man who wears socks with pound signs on them and Spitfire cufflinks — so terrify the political class? Part of it is that he deliberately doesn’t play by their rules. Indeed, out on the campaign trail with him this week I was struck by how he seems to think, ‘What would a politician do?’, and then do the opposite. I suspect that any member of the Cabinet or shadow cabinet who fancied a tipple at 11 a.m. would only succumb if they were sure no else was watching. But when the drinks trolley rattled past our seat at 11.08 a.m. (Farage is an unembarrassed first-class traveller) his eyes lit up and he asked for a glass of red. At this point the train staff, who up until then had shown little interest in the party leader in their midst, broke into approving chatter.

He is also not part of the Westminster set which he derides as being full of people who went to the same schools and the same Oxbridge colleges, where they did the same degree before going straight into a party research office with no knowledge of life outside politics. He tells me that the last time he talked to Cameron was four years ago. That this was at a dinner chaired by his father is a reminder that Farage also comes from a privileged background; he’s a product of P.G. Wodehouse’s alma mater, -Dulwich College, and followed his father into the City.

It is, though, perhaps the issue that Farage wields so deftly as an electoral weapon that most frightens the political class: immigration. Immigration was the second biggest cause of people stopping voting Labour between 1997 and 2010. Miliband’s recovery strategy (to Tony Blair’s great annoyance) is to persuade voters that Labour really would handle the issue differently next time round. So it is unsurprising that Farage savages Labour’s record when he’s campaigning in its strongholds. He claims, ‘There are an enormous number of old Labour voters out there who are just completely without anyone speaking for them.’

Farage says that these voters are harder to reach than disaffected Tories. He says, ‘They don’t actually engage in current affairs in perhaps the way that they might have done in years gone past.’ But he posits that doorstep campaigning and ‘simple, straightforward messages that resonate’ can win them over. He even speculates that ‘Ukip may hurt Labour more in the European elections than we hurt the Conservative party.’

Significantly, immigration has now become Farage’s way of talking about how EU membership affects Britain and why voters should care about it. He asserts that ‘immigration will dominate the referendum campaign’ when it comes. He also admits that ‘a lot of Ukip’s success will depend on this issue’, and whether its claims about the impact of Romanian and Bulgarian immigration are borne out.

In recent days, the Tories’ anti-Ukip strategy has begun to emerge. It has three main elements. The first of these is emphasising to voters that the next general election is about whether Cameron or Miliband is Prime Minister. The second is stressing that the Tories are the only party who can actually deliver a referendum on Europe or control of immigration. The third, in a change of tactics, is an end to insulting Ukip. No. 10 made clear on Monday that Ken Clarke was off-message when he attacked Ukip as ‘clowns’ at the weekend. Instead, the Tories plan to let others do this work for them. The fourth estate will be pointed towards any Ukip candidate who comes close to meeting Cameron’s description of them as mostly ‘fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists’.

When I put this strategy to Farage, his response was, ‘short term, the first one would worry me more. If Miliband comes up with a very left-wing [manifesto], that potentially could be hurtful.’ He tried to dismiss the second point by saying that Labour will be offering a referendum by 2015 and that ‘Mr Cameron attempting to campaign on immigration will be a very major mistake indeed’ if, as Farage expects, there is a huge spike  in Romanian and Bulgarian migrants.

The lengths to which Ukip are going to vet its candidates after this week’s events, though, suggest that the third part of the Tory strategy is the one that concerns them most at the moment. I understand that the party has already started checking the CVs of general election candidates and is videoing interviews with them. It is also considering requiring those wanting to stand at the European elections to open up their credit records for inspection.

Ukip is changing as a party. It is becoming a more hard-headed, pragmatic outfit. Farage warns that ‘You don’t want to have policies that distract from your main objectives in life.’ He wants to drop the 2010 proposal for a flat tax, which is attacked by both Labour and the Lib Dems as a policy that would see the poor pay more and the rich less. He plans to replace it with a two-rate tax system, with one set at 40p, which will, in Farage’s words, be ‘seen to be fairer’.

Many predicted that coalition would see a return to two-party politics. But what we’re seeing in England today is the emergence of four-party politics. Ukip is moving to fill the protest party vacancy created by the Liberal Democrats, while simultaneously winning over disillusioned Tory and Labour voters.

The question is, can an anti-politics party succeed in the long run? If it can, then the political explosion Ukip is about to spark could blow traditional politics apart.

James Forsyth talks Ukip — spectator.co.uk/podcast.

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Show comments
  • James

    Cameron has shown his cards and he doesn’t have a good hand. Despite suggestion of a referendum being enshrined into law for 2018, it is simply too little too late – we don’t want mass immigration and EU nonsense in the meantime and we don’t want a referendum only if we vote Dave. If Ed were elected, Cameron only has himself to blame for not having backbone and ignoring the wishes of those who voted to elect him in power. Sadly, we’ve got a conservative Tony Blair and we know how dangerous that can be, which is why I will vote UKIP because politicians need to come back to reality and start doing what they are elected to do: serve the nation.

  • CaptainDallas

    Nothing Cameron says at this point will ever persuade me to vote Conservative again. I’m voting UKIP today.

    • Matt

      What about “I’m resigning” ?

      • emptyend

        Still not good enough, I suspect. He’s breached the trust of voters, not least on the marriage issue.

        • ScaryBiscuits

          Yes, I don’t think we’d even trust him if he said he’d resigned. At the very least, he’d have to leave parliament and take a few of his more odious cronies and wets with him (Nick Hurd etc).

      • http://www.facebook.com/simon.smalley1 Simon Smalley

        I dont think that will now change anying even if cameron resigns if you want to get up the politicains noses vote UKIP it winds them up totally

      • fubar_saunders

        Hahaha. But to be replaced by who? Carswell or Hannan perhaps, but I cant see either of them having much of a chance.

      • NeilMc1

        Who’d believe him?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/David-Julian-Price/653286113 David Julian Price

    Interesting times. It seems UKIP are doing to the Tories what the SDP did to Labour circa 1981, which is to grab the party’s more right wing voters and also disaffected voters from all sides. If the Tories are to survive 2015 then they’ll need a pact with UKIP of some sort; if Cameron was prepared to deal with the lefty Lib Dems he should be even more accommodating to UKIP.

    • http://www.facebook.com/simon.smalley1 Simon Smalley

      Yeh but at the end of the day this is differnt UKIP are no way like the SDP. UKIP is now a anti political party.

    • WatTylersGhost

      ” if Cameron was prepared to deal with the lefty Lib Dems he should be even more accommodating to UKIP”

      Why? He has much more in common with the Lib Dems than he does with UKIP – wake up.

  • an ex-tory voter

    Some years ago UKIP was considered to be a joke. Nowadays it is the three main parties who are seen a joke and a very bad one at that.

    Everyone who knows and works with me is under no illusion as to how deeply and for how long I have despised David Cameron. They also know that my political and worldview prevent me from ever voting for the Clegg or Milliband tribes. They knew me for the “disenfranchised voter” that I was.

    For years my views on politics and the environment led me to be scorned. But, no longer, the “sheeple” have lifted their heads, now at last they are looking around and listening. Now the world is beginning to move in my direction.

    This week during an office coffee break, I announced my intention of voting UKIP. Not a single person demurred and most confirmed they intend to do exactly the same. In truth I do not know of a single family member, friend, or colleague who is not going to vote for UKIP today.

    Happy days and sunlit uplands.

    • Aled Lumley

      Funnily enough, if you fill a parliament full of lawyers, the “lawyers blank cheque legal aid” bill goes through the roof.

      Remove the parasites..

      Not sure I massively agree with UKIP policies, some are common sense and likeable, but dear god at least Farage talks like a human being you can relate to. On top of that a pretty educated one who can handle strong issues, I have to be honest I quite like the EU and open borders, Bulgaria could be a tricky one with it’s reputation so we’ll see.

      The ‘typical man on the street’ has no interest in Milliband and may only respect Cameron for his PR media appearance.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Andrew-Smith/1386738275 Andrew Smith

        I wonder what aspects of “the EU and open borders” it is you like. Pro-integrationists often claim that if we were to leave the EU we would be unable to buy balsamic vinegar anymore and holidays on the Costas would be a thing of the past – OK, OK I exaggerated, but they do claim that travel to the EU and buying/selling would be very very difficult. Those claims are, of course, rot. We would be able to carry on much as now but without the costs and without the rules. As far as open borders are concerned, your predecessors were able to find servants a century before the EU took control of our borders, so I am sure there would be people available for service when nice cheap Poles were unable to come at will.

        • Arbeideren

          “Pro-integrationists often claim that if we were to leave the EU we would be unable to buy balsamic vinegar anymore and holidays on the Costas would be a thing of the past ”

          You forget to mention the horrors of bringing your own passport with you when travelling elsewhere in Europe. That is what the politicos scare voters with here. I’m talking about leaving or renegotiating the EEC agreement. Polls show overwhelming support for doing that. We too are fed up with the open door immigration politics and massive public spending.

          The good news, UKIPs Norwegian counterpart, the Progress Party, shall govern Norway( in a coalition with the Tories) after Parliament elections this year…


          • Paul

            The FrP aren’t actually anti-EU officially though are they? They are ‘undecided’.

          • Arbeideren

            Joining the EU is a non-issue for every party. There is talk about renegotiating the EEC agreement. This poll reveal that about 17 percent of voters are for joining and 70 percent against: http://www.nationen.no/2011/10/23/politikk/eu/eu-barometer/heming_olaussen/nei_til_eu/7003314/

          • Paul

            Is FrP one of the political parties supporting a renegotiation of EEA, or perhaps even leaving EEA altogether? (I’d go for that second option.)

          • Arbeideren

            I have no idea what EEA is. Maybe it’s that agreement with the EU called EØS. FrP have stated that it must be changed. In particular those paragraphs dealing with social benefits for foreigners and immigration. There is a third world/eastern Europe tsunami of jobseekers, welfare-seekers and criminals that must be dealt with. The costs are so enormous I fear they will lead to national bankruptcy. Hence, I vote for and pay membership to FrP.

          • Paul

            Sorry, yes – EEA (“European Economic Area”) means EØS in Norwegian: “europeiske økonomiske samarbeidsområde”.

            What I’m suggesting is that the best way of getting out would be to leave EØS, because I doubt you’ll get what you want in it. From what I’ve read of EØS, it was set up in the early 1990s as a stopgap solution towards EU membership. EU membership hasn’t happened, and the Norwegian public don’t want it. (You probably already know that it’s the politicians who are so strongly in favour of remaining in EØS.)

            What I was suggesting was that it would be better if Norway left that arrangement altogether, left the free movement of peoples, passport-free travel (Schengen Area) and benefits for immigration, and focused on a free trade agreement with EU only. So we’re in total agreement essentially.

            We in UKIP want this kind of arrangement. No anti-EU voices in Britain are asking for EØS membership, although the pro-EU politicians insist on bringing it up as an option.

            For what it’s worth, I’ve spoken to the odd Norwegian, and last time I spoke to him he was very interested in voting FrP. If I lived in Norway, that’s where my vote would be going to also.

            For folk flest! 😉

          • Arbeideren

            I guess you already found this but this brochure about FrP might be interesting for other UKIP members to read: http://www.frp.no/A+Change+for+the+Better+-+A+Brief+Introduction+to+the+Progress+Party+Brochure.d25-TwBvY55.ips

          • Paul

            I hadn’t already seen this, no, but it sums up why I’d want to vote for the party.

            In essence, the classical liberal wing of UKIP and the FrP are identical going from that manifesto. I’m a particular fan of some of Christian Tybring-Gjedde’s speeches.

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100005564941289 Bill Bob

      It is fascinating to see that you found it necessary to state that you disclosed your vote in an ‘office coffee break’. I had this image in mind of all these closet-racists, like yourself, hiding behind their ballot slips, as if they acknowledged their despicable deeds. But now your’e story puts it into perspective. I had a negative image in mind of all UKIP voters, as you cannot measure different levels of support when talking about right wing politics, it’s very black and white. But having read your story, you made my stomach churn. It reminds me of the stories you read about after Hitler’s Munich Putsch.

      • http://twitter.com/ChristopherRed6 AllSeeingOracle

        Very reassuring to hear of your stomach churning Bill, as I had to stifle a vomit-reflex of my own reading your views.

        If you need to view all UKIP voters as closet racists and have such a simplistic ‘black and white’ way of judging them then fair enough, I am happy to be labelled a closet racist by the likes of yourself if it makes you feel better about yourself, because you’re special kid.

        Please continue to vote Lib-Dem/Green Party or whatever else floats your boat!

  • Austin Barry

    Today is the turn of the screwed.

    • The Sage

      Let’s hope so and fingers crossed.
      But insignificant elections of this kind are usually ignored by our political class or shrugged off as mid-term blues.
      Even if UKIP won over 100 council seats there would be no impact in Westminister.
      I suspect that if UKIP were to secure the biggest share of the vote in next year’s European elections, then it would still be business as normal from a government perspective.
      Winning South Shields (very unlikely) might have more of an impact.
      It will only be the 2015 general election, when the Conservatives in particular see that a majority is just not possible, that some notice might finally be taken of UKIP and an accommodation reached.
      But let’s see.

      • itzman

        Indeed they (elections of this kind) USUALLY are (insignificant).

        The thing is that Nigel is a crafty sod. He knows that in the Westminster bubble, the only back path of communication is polls and poll results.

        So a massive turnout for UKIP will have far far more effect on Westminster than it will have on local politics.

        He is using the main parties preoccupation with votes and power as a weapon against them. They can only mount media campaigns. They aren’t even capable of a grass roots campaign any more.

        And the smear campaign has backfired as well. Because Nigel has never told people he is an angel, or his party are moral gods, finding a few with clay feet – especially when secretly a lot of the electorate have clay feet themselves – is doing no harm at all.

        To UKIP.

        It is however confirming that there is truly something very nasty about the conservatives.

        This is political drama, it’s not about which persons will fail to make any difference at local level at all. Because it is apparent that local councils are beholden to central government and central government is beholden to the European superstate and that is owned lock stock an barrel by large multinationals and banks..

    • itzman


  • Bob339

    Cameron is finished. The tories are finished. UKIP forever!

  • Stuck-Record

    Does David Cameron actually believe that there is anyone in the country (who wanted an EU referendum) who actually believes that he, or any other mainstream politician, will give them one?

    This political class; Conservative, Labour and Liberal Democrat, are all in thrall to the EU. They will twist and turn in the wind to avoid the people of the UK (and of Europe for that matter) being allowed to express their democratic opinion.

    That said, I still think that UKIP’s only affect will be to destroy any potential Conservative majority and allow a loony left-wing Labour government, in hock to the unions to take power and destroy UK business .

    Unfortunately, I can’t think of any thing we can do to avoid this. As voting for the current Conservative party sticks in the throat.

    • an ex-tory voter

      Sadly, I suspect you are correct in your prediction. But, it may be a necessary and inevitable step in the process of political realignment.

      If Eastern Europe can free itself from the Soviets there is no reason why the British people cannot free themselves from their oppressors in Whitehall, Westminster and Brussels.

      • Stuck-Record

        I don’t share your optimism.

        The tipping point is the 51 percent rule. (In reality it’s much much lower). Once that percentage of the population becomes dependent on government largesse through their jobs or benefits regime, democracy in those countries is finished. No political party offering a platform that will end or reduce that largesse can achieve power after that point. Turkeys simply do not vote for Christmas. The left wing project will have succeeded.

        We can’t afford another Labour government in this country. The march towards that percentage proceeds inexorably.

        • fubar_saunders

          You both make very valid points.

          but, the fact that turkeys dont vote for Christmas does not stop Christmas from coming anyway. Eitherway, the prospect of a sovereign bond crisis when the bond bubble finally bursts and inflation runs away at a height not seen since the late 70’s, is likely to happen after 2015 anyway…. if it waits that long, depending on what happens to the EU project.

        • therealguyfaux

          Re: “Tipping Point”

          Mitt Romney said the same thing, in effect, and was promptly ganged up on by all and sundry. What people didn’t realise was that he was probably too candid for his own good and chalked it up to “gaffes,” as if it were a matter of good manners to continue to evade the truth without some notice being taken. (And the British Press got their licks in on him as well, with his Olympic comments– geez, the organiser of the 2002 Winter Games was asked for a professional opinion, and when he gave one, you kvetch about it!) So, of course, the key to success in politics is never to say you see the elephant in the room, but instead to play one of the blind men and say it’s everything but.

    • James

      Boris may put himself forward for leadership and all he has to do is agree with the public on the EU and do something about national security issues.

      • Nicholas_Keen

        Johnson recently showed how weak he is on Europe: as soon as the City people got around him he buckled under.

    • Damon

      Indeed, a Labour government (probably with a working majority) now seems all but inevitable in 2015. Think Cameron is soft on immigration? Wait til you have Miliband. Think Cameron is a closet Europhile? Wait til you have Miliband. I’m always puzzled that you UKIP types, while merely disdainful of LibDems and Labour, seem to have an obsessive hatred of the Tories. It is, I suspect, the rage of the rejected suitor. Your main line seems to be, ‘Anyone but the Tories, and b-gger the consequences.’ Very responsible.

      • Stuck-Record

        Damon, I agree.

        But it’s a measure of quite how appallingly the Conservatives have treated their own natural supporters that they would even countenance risking the kind of government that the Milliband wagon would bring in.

        It’s not too late to bring those voters back, but Cameron and co can’t do it. Natural conservatives don’t believe he is one. He’s, at heart, too desperate to be liked by the BBC and the Liberal establishment to do anything to risk offending them.

        He’s the problem, not the solution. There are still those in the Conservative party who would be trusted though, Michael Gove etc.

    • greggf

      “….I still think that UKIP’s only affect will be to destroy any potential Conservative majority and allow a loony left-wing Labour government..”

      That’s what “they” want you to think Stuck.
      Rentoul pedals that line in the Indy.

      UKIPs vote is more likely to deny both of the big 2 an overall majority, and coalitions will be sought. It’s probable the LibDems will be unable to “help” and the intriguing possibility of a Lab/Con coalition could result; Dave and Ed might share the PMs job taking it in turns…..

      If UKIP is really the anti-political party then that’s the outcome most suitable – like Italy!

  • zanzamander

    But what we’re seeing in England today is the emergence of four-party politics.


    On all the main issues like EU, immigration etc. there is nothing to distinguish Labour from the Tories from the LibDems – they are all LibDems and on one side, Ukip is on another.

    Two Party politics.

    Voters will vote for the party that fills their pockets with fat welfare cheques. Look around you, the country is filled with almost 50% of voters who are second and third generation immigrants – they will never vote for Ukip. The remainder are lazy, stupid and ignorant, again they will never vote Ukip.

    Ukip as an experiment is good but nothing will come out of it.

    • http://www.facebook.com/simon.smalley1 Simon Smalley

      No I believe things are no changing for the better.

  • Simon Fowler

    But UKIP offers fantasy politics. Britain needs the EU more than the EU needs us. Immigration is actually good for the UK and the impact of the Bulgarians and Romanians is likely to be small.
    Nigel Farage is an engaging character – certainly compared with the other political leaders. But what does he really offer – a return to the comforting certainties of sixty years ago. Lets get real here. We need policies and politics for the 2010s not the 1950s.

    • david.geddes1

      Well said Comrade. But don’t forget how beautiful the fifties were when we were all back there in Moscow.

    • http://twitter.com/Hitchslap_82 Andy M

      No we don’t need the EU – as Farage has pointed out on numerous occasions. We can still do trade with EU nations without being in the EU, just without the rest of the EU bureaucracy that people in this country do not want. It is too simplistic to make a statement like “immigration is good for the UK”. Immigration CAN be good. It can also be bad though.

      Right now, we are full. We don’t need any more people coming in. We have plenty of skilled workers already here and we have many skilled workers here looking for jobs who are currently unemployed. In no way is immigration going to make this situation any better, only worse. An influx of Bulgarians and Romanians is not of any good to our country either. As statistics show, a huge percentage of crimes in London were carried out by Romanians. Why add to that percentage? We also don’t need any more people coming in and taking our country’s money through benefits.

      There is no logical argument for further immigration at present.

      • Brian Mooney

        Has anybody calculated the effect of a large population growth on grid power supply? Given that our generating capacity is being run down by an EU Directive, control of our borders and energy could be quite significant voting factors in 2014 and 2015?
        We are not given much comfort by our elected representatives many of whom are in love with wind turbines everywhere, and Cameron noticeably moved his one minister who did something positive by increasing the gas supply.

      • Paul

        Not forgetting the fact that it really isn’t good for Bulgaria or Romania, either. It will lead to a brain drain for these countries and will lead to them struggling to move forward in the world.

        I personally don’t think that it’s emphasised enough how bad this will be for their native lands either.

        The best thing for Bulgarians and Romanians is that they stay in their own country and contribute to it being a fairer, less violent, more equitable and better place to live.

    • http://www.facebook.com/simon.smalley1 Simon Smalley

      well according to migration watch small being half a percent point of each country of bulgaria and romania thats 150,000 and 100,000 for bulgaria that is just unbelievable and thats based on your and migration watch small estimate to dred to think what it would be big percentage common sense will rule.

  • http://twitter.com/Roger_V Roger V

    Actually, what we need is not a referendum, but the serving of a notice, under article 50, to quit the EU.

    • ScaryBiscuits

      Presumably, this could be done under Crown Prerogative so wouldn’t need the agreement of the LibDems?

  • http://twitter.com/Hitchslap_82 Andy M

    I am disappointed that I am not in the UK at the moment, as I would most certainly vote UKIP if I was. This move where people are finally giving credit to UKIP has the feeling of revolution about it. It makes sense though – a Conservative party that isn’t Conservative vs a Labour party with no solutions to any problems that they caused. Why would anyone with common-sense vote for either?

  • UKIP_Bill

    I don’t think UKIP is anti-politics at all. Indeed all the supporters I know are very interested in politics. What they and I loath are the current crop of corrupt politicians and the media lackeys who suck up to them.


  • Sickofgreen

    I think that Ukip have started to gain support because the stench of corruption and self interest has simply become too strong. People are at last beginning to wake up to the fact that there could be an alternative – to the 50 shades of green that are infesting the HOC & NGO’s.

    Ukip have a sensible policy on energy and this more than any other issue could be the saving of the UK.

    For me Ukip have a common sense appeal, rather than the common purpose alternative of the Europhiles.

  • john

    UKIP Is yet another piece of evidence that Britain has given up looking forward and simply wants to fight over the status quo. Economic growth is feeble, the populace is fed a never ending stream of royal B/S and the Tories are looking more and more like their 1950s predecessors. Farage is just playing on this mood of national apathy and expoiting it.

    • http://twitter.com/Adrian_Wainer Adrian Wainer

      ” UKIP Is yet another piece of evidence that Britain has given up looking forward and simply wants to fight over the status quo. Economic growth is feeble, the populace is fed a never ending stream of royal B/S and the Tories are looking more and more like their 1950s predecessors. Farage is just playing on this mood of national apathy and expoiting it. “,.

      UKIP is a marker that plenty of people in Britain want a <> party and are fed up with being bullied, robbed, insulted, demeaned and policed stated by Cameron, Clegg and Millipede LibLabCon.

      BOAC VC10 Advertisement 1960/70s

  • http://www.facebook.com/simon.smalley1 Simon Smalley

    When people tell you that thee wont be much migration from bulgaria and romania they are unfortunatly true migration watch predicted that 1% frach each country turns out AT……150,000 romania 100,00bulgaria thats based on the lowest figures so yeh wont be much and UKIP all the way.

  • JackHodgsenDundee

    I’ve just voted in Bristol. I was really disappointed to see no UKIP candidate in my area. I ended up voting Tory because I’d still prefer them over Lab/Lib. But next time I can vote UKIP I will.

    • http://www.facebook.com/pjl20 Paul Latham

      We cannot spirit people to come forward and become candidates in elections. Out of around 50 party members in my district, only one came forward to volunteer as one. I even had someone complain to me today, like you have, about why no UKIP candidate in his Division? . He immediately joined with us as a new member. Thanks for that, at least.

      • JackHodgsenDundee

        I’m not angry at UKIP, I just assumed that a candidate would be fielded here. I’ll vote for them whenever I can, though. I was more angry at being forced to vote Tory. I’ll join now.

        • http://www.facebook.com/pjl20 Paul Latham

          Welcome aboard, Jack.

      • Paul

        Have you not worked out that some people simply might not be suitable to be UKIP candidates for whatever reason? These sorts of people might be quite happy to help other candidates, but don’t feel up to or able of standing themselves.

    • worzel1

      You should have spoilt the ballot paper. Friends of mine who also had no candidate just wrote UKIP right over all of them

  • Alfie

    I’m voting UKIP! And I have done for the past few years! Down with political correctness, and politicians who sound like robots! Go Mr Farage, and the rest of you clowns and loonies! Britain salutes you :-)

  • Smithersjones2013

    The idea that UKIP is anti politics is somewhat shy of the mark. Its more a case that UKIP is anti consensus. In many ways it is now acting as the primary opposition to the Westminster Cabal. Now opposing the consensus is still politics…….

    Why is political journalism so slovenly these days? Whilst I know that Westminster has a very high opinion of itself it is not the be all and end all of politics.

  • paulus

    If they think they can depose the leader of the conservative party and Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, they are total fruitcakes. They have nothing absolutely nothing to negotiate with, a bunch of hair brained billies, thinking they are more than what they are: which is fuck all. That weirdo from the green party has more leverage, why do you think there is a green energy policy.

    • James

      Perhaps you should think about whether people vote leaders out?

    • http://twitter.com/Adrian_Wainer Adrian Wainer

      ” If they think they can depose the leader of the conservative party and Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, they are total fruitcakes. They have nothing absolutely nothing to negotiate with, a bunch of hair brained billies, thinking they are more than what they are: which is f*ck all. That weirdo from the green party has more leverage, why do you think there is a green energy policy. “,.

      * Edited from the original.

      Have much fun in Stalingrad, Herr paulus ?

      Monty python-hitler scene!


  • http://twitter.com/Adrian_Wainer Adrian Wainer

    Ideally LibLabCon will be destroyed by late Friday 05 03 2013 UK Zulu time.


  • jim1999

    First off if 250,000 Romanians and Bulgarians come to the UK that would be less than a 0.4% increase in the total population of the UK and frankly I welcome them.

    It takes effort and courage to pick up and move one’s life to another country. Those coming here will be young and eager to work unlike the shiftless and lazy British born who are happy to collect their benefit cheques and drink a few tins of special brew.

    The British people have turned into a drunk and indolent lot and resent hard workers who get on in life.

    • http://twitter.com/Adrian_Wainer Adrian Wainer

      ” First off if 250,000 Romanians and Bulgarians come to the UK that would be less than a 0.4% increase in the total population of the UK and frankly I welcome them.

      It takes effort and courage to pick up and move one’s life to another country. Those coming here will be young and eager to work unlike the shiftless and lazy British born who are happy to collect their benefit cheques and drink a few tins of special brew.

      The British people have turned into a drunk and indolent lot and resent hard workers who get on in life. “,.

      Are you trying to put together a CV to get a position as a spokesperson for the Жалезная гвардыя ? By the way is Adolf Hilter a friend of yours, I thought I saw you with him in Minehead ?


      • jim1999


        No idea how you got there but thanks for proving Godwin’s law. By the by before one goes and rants and raves about foreigners ruining Britain one should look at the work the British are doing to ruin their own country.


    • http://www.facebook.com/daniel.james.9674 Frankie James

      Because thats the society that LIBLABCON created for them.We need change see?

    • Jonny Oyster

      What a horribly racist post! To brand the entire British people as drunk and indolent is at best ignorant and at worst totally offensive. the influx of 250,00 Romanian and Bulgarian immigrants would have a massive impact on Britain, we are already struggling to find school places, homes and hospital beds for people already living here, to say that another quarter of a million people would not put further pressure on resources is frankly madness.

      • jim1999

        no more than the screaming hordes who fear the gypsy invasion… sorry our Romanian and Bulgarian comrades. sheesh

    • terence patrick hewett

      Try saying that to a Nissan worker in Sunderland: I wouln’t give much hope for your life expectancy.

      • jim1999

        have you been to a McDonald’s lately and mingled with the chavs?

    • Zachariah

      Except the British drink less than ever before and work on average longer hours, in jobs with less security.

  • http://twitter.com/Adrian_Wainer Adrian Wainer

    South Shields: Hugh Annand (LD) 352, Howling Laud Hope (Loony) 197. I think there should be a recount as it seems implausible that a relatively sensible Loony would poll less than the dreadful Lib Dems ?

  • Major Plonquer

    I think I’m the only person on this forum who can categorically state that I will certainly NOT be voting for UKIP, either now, in the 2014 European elections or in the next General election. There are many reasons for this but probably the most important is that I live in China. But if I lived in the UK I’d be first in line.

  • Latimer Alder

    Farage 3 Machine 0 …so far

  • Stuart

    Let them have a referendum. Yes there is a lot of people out there who want out of Europe but then there are a lot of people who want out of the UK. These aren’t the majority. Most people want change, not an exit. This slightly reminds me of UK politics in late 2009. The lib Dems got a spike in the polls and it was widely believed that they would get 30 odd percent in the general election in 2010. They were proved fantasies in the end as they basically stood still.
    Now I’m not suggesting that that is the case but I don’t want my country’s politics being shoved wildly to the right over fear of what might happen. I understand the fear, and one or two concerns. However I don’t want to detail many of the things we take for granted because of misplaced dogma -and it is just that.
    The idea that it is ok to opt out of the bits of law just because you don’t like some side effects is somewhat absurd. Ukip is trying to catch all the disaffected which sounds good until you realise that you can’t please all people. Flat rate taxes. No right to freedom of speech because rather than fix the extradition treaties they’d rather put cuffs on the judges so they can’t get checks and balances. If 10 years of labour proved nothing else it should prove that vesting the power of the state so much in one man is dangerous.

  • sunfly

    When i hear [family people and not the business people] numerous former working class great grandads and great grandmothers talking politics like never before and enraged at the present government but enthused about UKIP to their numerous offspring i know something special is happening. The present lower classes those unemployed and those lower than even the smug 1st generation middle class people are enraged and suffering and have been betrayed in that the politicians in power backed by the middle classes and tories have steamed ahead with capitalist cuts to pay for the banking crisis and aptly masked it as a recession to create their generation as the poor and needy and that have to rely on there other familymembers for help because they now have to live on a pitance while the ruling government takes decisions we do not want.Unemployment benefit is at a lower rate in comparison to what it was 40 years ago and those poor people many young teenagers,and those in the twenties,in their 30,s in their 40,s,in their 50,s,in their 60,s in their 70,s are struggling to exist on a day to day basis

    • http://twitter.com/stevetierney Steve Tierney

      I almost want UKIP to win so I can see them cut and spend more at the same time. Promises, promises, so easy to make. Until you are in power. And then you can’t and you try to explain and nobody believes you.

  • balakris

    Does Britain really want to take this giant step backward and isolate itself?
    Thought the British had far more brains.

    • Jim_Watford

      Is every country outside the EU isolated? we want to leave the E.U not close all the borders and put a wall around the country. We want to trade with the world as a nation, not as a bit part of the E.U.

    • Paul

      Is Switzerland, Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein or San Marino isolated?

      Think about what you say before you say it.

      We want a trading, familial and other relationship with our near-and-far neighbours every bit as strong – perhaps even stronger – than it can ever be from the EU.

      I want my country to strongly co-operate with every European country on matters that affect our countries. I do not want to be ruled by an unelected dictatorship that acts as a parasite on all EU members. I want France to be run by Frenchmen, Italy to be run by Italians, Denmark to be run by the Danes, and so on.

  • terrygreenfield

    Over Christmas, during the usual family discussions, I predicted that UKIP would do well in these council elections, do better still in the European elections and be the deciding factor in the next general election, even if they win few seats. Needless to say I was not believed.

    UKIP is generally seen by both main parties as a right wing anti European, anti emigrant and perhaps thought to have raciest overtones, and mainly a danger to
    Conservative right wing membership.

    I do not see it that way at all…. I see UKIP as a “Libertarian” party. That offers
    a home to any one “Little Englander” or not who fears “Big Government”, or outside power, is jealous of those who are seen to be doing better from the state than themselves. Who fear that they are not getting a fair share of a diminishing pie. Who believe their lack of employment is caused by too many incomers.

    It does not even seem to be a question of intelligence or education but rather one of
    life experience and fear. The party appeals to those at any financial level in society who have a surfeit of fear for their future.

    Such people are to be found in all the Parties, perhaps fewer in the Lib Dems than the others, but are very evenly spread through out the population.

    In this latest council election it seems at first glance that the Conservative suffered most for UKIP attrition. However I think the true position is disguised by
    the poor turn out and the fact that recent government policies are
    unpopular with everyone especially the people I have described.

    I do suspect that they took votes from all parties, but fairly evenly from both
    conservative and labour. I suspect the disproportionate effect on the
    Conservative and Lib Dems can be accounted for, from a few right
    wing extremist changing sides, but mostly by the disenchanted
    floating voter seeking comfort for their fears they build around
    Europe, lack of jobs, and welfare cuts.

    Both the conservative and labour policies and the associated blame culture, feed these fears.

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